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Handman
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 13:51 | IP Logged
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I have a pantry light that keeps turning itself on in the middle of the night (and no, no one is making midnight raids). In fact, I have a macro that turns the panty light off 90 seconds after the light is turned on (specifically: Trigger type: Insteon Device Change; Trigger ID Number : (Any) [I really don’t know what this does]; Trigger Value: ON; Boolean: 1). This works fine when the pantry light is turned on manually or if the light is turned on “manually” using PH. The odd thing is that I always find the pantry light on in the middle of the night, but there is no record of the light being turned on within the event log! Of course it isn’t easy to parse through the event logs ad nauseum. I see that there is a filter function for the event log, but I cannot find any instructions for how to use it. Is it possible to have the event log show events pertaining to just one Insteon address? If so, how?
I also thought that the light might be erroneously responding a wireless X-10 motion sensor. Yet, I have never set up the switch this way, and PH does not indicate an X-10 address for any of my Insteon devices. Just to be safe, I air-gapped the switch, which is supposed to remove any stored X-10 house codes in the device. Unfortunately, last night the light was on again. The thing I don’t understand is that if the light turned on somehow, wouldn’t it send out a group cleanup indicating that it was turned on?? There are a few random unmapped commands that occur during the night, but if one of those turned on the device, there should be a group cleanup from the device saying “Hey, I’m ON.” Right?
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grif091
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 14:17 | IP Logged
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Someone else will have to comment on how to do an SQL search for the pantry light.
Powerhome will retrieve the X10 information from a device only if the "Level/Ramp/X10 Scan" option is checked under Insteon Explorer.
Air gapping a switch does not reset the device. it simply removes power from the device. To factory reset you have to pull the air gap switch for some seconds and then press it in past its normal resting position for a few seconds. The time required is written in the Quick Start guide or the User Guide for the particular device. If you do a factory reset the links will also be erased.
A Group Cleanup command is part of the Group command sequence issued by the controller device that issued a Group sequence to turn the responder device on. The responder device does not respond with the Group Cleanup Direct command when it is turned on. The responder will send an ACK if it receives a Group Cleanup Direct. Of course the ACK applies to the Insteon command, not an X10 command.
Edited by grif091 - April 24 2009 at 14:33
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BeachBum
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 14:28 | IP Logged
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Maybe we can trap it. If you haven’t done this yet set up a Raw Log file by going to PH Explore – Setup _ Controllers _ Settings and Put a path in the Echo Log File. Do a Reinit to set the parameters. When you retire for the night open Insteon Explorer and check Echo Raw Log File. Do NOT close the window but you can minimize it thought. In the morning uncheck the same box to close the file. See if you can isolate the device by its address. If you have a problem post it here and Lee or I will go through it. I have seen some Insteon devices come on with noise but not predictable as yours.
Edit: Lee my typing is much slower than yours. I don’t have a SQL type for addresses I can do Insteon In and Out.
Edited by BeachBum - April 24 2009 at 14:31
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BeachBum
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 14:55 | IP Logged
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One way to reset the light using this formula.
IF (ph_getinsteonlevelrt("id of light") > 0 , ph_insteon(“id of light”, 19, 0), 1)
You can place it in a timed event. Your event log will show if the light had to be turned off and what time. I have to go back to the noise issue. If the module is near a circuit where you were experiencing problems on the earlier post it indeed may be associated with noise that occurs at a particular time of night.
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Handman
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 17:25 | IP Logged
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Lee, I have the level/ramp/x10 scan turned on. You are right, the procedure to remove an X10 address, assuming one is in the switch, is more involved than air-gapping. Maybe I'll do it just to rule it out. Sending links is a piece of cake with PH, especially because this one has few links.
Pete, I have been logging the raw insteon for a few days now in connection with the clear-failed issue on the PLM, so I'll see if I can find anything there. Do either of you have a list of Insteon codes. It would make it easier to understand what is being commanded in the raw logs. Just so I understand correctly, the formula you gave me will be activated by a timed event late at night. If the light was on, the formula will create an entry in the event log. This insteon device has not always done this and is also not near anything that might be creating noise from my earlier post. It started happening in the last two months. "Random" noise might turn something on once or twice, but this predictably . . . that seems like a stretch.
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Handman
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 17:46 | IP Logged
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Well, this was from the other night. The switch's id comes up 20 times and then six minutes later comes up twenty times,then six minutes later . . . at least for the hour I looked at. My PLM address is 0F.44.B1 and the light that keeps turning on at night is 03.78.49 (an icon dimmer). Can you figure out if this explains what is turning the light on? (I don't have the event log for this and I, unfortunately, don't have a raw log where I have an event log (because I reinitialized PH and forgot to recheck the "write to log" box yesterday). 
2009-04-22 00:45:11.390 TX &nbs p; 02 62 03 78 49 0F 19 00
2009-04-22 00:45:11.406 RX &nbs p; SENTINSTEON=0F 44 B1 03 78 49 0F 19 00 06
2009-04-22 00:45:11.703 RX &nbs p; RECEIVEINSTEONRAW=03 78 49 0F 44 B1 2B 00 00
2009-04-22 00:45:11.781 TX &nbs p; 02 62 03 78 49 05 28 00
2009-04-22 00:45:11.796 RX &nbs p; SENTINSTEON=0F 44 B1 03 78 49 05 28 00 06
2009-04-22 00:45:12.062 RX &nbs p; RECEIVEINSTEONRAW=03 78 49 0F 44 B1 21 28 00
2009-04-22 00:45:12.125 TX &nbs p; 02 62 03 78 49 05 2B 22
2009-04-22 00:45:12.140 RX &nbs p; SENTINSTEON=0F 44 B1 03 78 49 05 2B 22 06
2009-04-22 00:45:12.343 RX &nbs p; RECEIVEINSTEONRAW=03 78 49 0F 44 B1 21 2B 98
2009-04-22 00:45:12.406 TX &nbs p; 02 62 03 78 49 05 2B 32
2009-04-22 00:45:12.421 RX &nbs p; SENTINSTEON=0F 44 B1 03 78 49 05 2B 32 06
2009-04-22 00:45:12.640 RX &nbs p; RECEIVEINSTEONRAW=03 78 49 0F 44 B1 21 2B FE
2009-04-22 00:45:12.703 TX &nbs p; 02 62 03 78 49 05 2B 21
2009-04-22 00:45:12.718 RX &nbs p; SENTINSTEON=0F 44 B1 03 78 49 05 2B 21 06
2009-04-22 00:45:12.921 RX &nbs p; RECEIVEINSTEONRAW=03 78 49 0F 44 B1 21 2B 1F
2009-04-22 00:45:13.000 TX &nbs p; 02 62 03 78 49 05 2B 30
2009-04-22 00:45:13.015 RX &nbs p; SENTINSTEON=0F 44 B1 03 78 49 05 2B 30 06
2009-04-22 00:45:13.218 RX &nbs p; RECEIVEINSTEONRAW=03 78 49 0F 44 B1 21 2B 20
2009-04-22 00:45:13.281 TX &nbs p; 02 62 03 78 49 05 2B 31
2009-04-22 00:45:13.296 RX &nbs p; SENTINSTEON=0F 44 B1 03 78 49 05 2B 31 06
2009-04-22 00:45:13.515 RX &nbs p; RECEIVEINSTEONRAW=03 78 49 0F 44 B1 21 2B 0C
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BeachBum
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 17:50 | IP Logged
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The Insteon Developers Guide has a lot of information pages 63 & 64. Also Insteon The Details page 18 & 21. The formula will set the light off if only it is on. A log entry will be there as a result of setting it off. I have a couple of lights that come on somewhere between 2 and 4. Don’t know why. But it is in my noise area (kitchen).
Edited by BeachBum - April 24 2009 at 17:59
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Pete - X10 Oldie
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BeachBum
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 17:55 | IP Logged
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OK Lee your turn. Let’s see how long…
Edited by BeachBum - April 24 2009 at 17:56
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grif091
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 18:02 | IP Logged
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More likely something is specifically turning on the panty light such as X10 or some Insteon message that is turning on the light but not triggering the macro. You can have a “responder to” link record in the pantry light that is responding to a Group Broadcast from some controller device but the controller device does not have a “controller of” link record so no specific Group Cleanup Direct is sent to the pantry light. This tends to show up as a broken link in PH if the link information in PH is current.
Also, as Pete said noise can do it but I would think the device would have to have an X10 address. The probably of noise forming a valid Insteon command with a valid CRC character is very unlikely.
Some common Insteon commands for device control in cmd1 field. These values will match the Insteon Raw Log trace entries. If looking at Event Log entries, convert the numbers to decimal. Ex 0x11 On is dec 17.
0x11 On
0x12 Fast On
0x13 Off
0x14 Fast Off
0x17 Start Dim/Bright
0x18 Stop Dim/Bright
0x19 Status Request
The trace you posted is most likely from a Status Scan of the pantry light. There is a Status Request command 0x19, followed by a Set Most Significant Byte (MSB) command 0x28 which sets the high order byte for memory access followed by a series of Peek commands 0x2B which are reading the device link database of the pantry switch 1 byte at a time. This is what PH does when it thinks the link database in the device may be at a different level than the information it has in PH database.
EDIT: the Peek commands 0x2B in the posted trace are actually pulling the preset values for Level, Ramp and probably X10 address. I don’t have a reference that has the memory map for an ICON switch but I will do some research tonight to see if I can find some online reference that has an ICON memory map. The link database retrieval would come after the commands in the post.
Edited by grif091 - April 24 2009 at 18:47
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BeachBum
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 20:14 | IP Logged
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It was the peek that got my attention. My reference on Icon Dimmers indicates that it don’t have too much in the way to support intelligence. So Lee why would it be peeking? Unless we have a module overtly declared incorrectly. Good news Handman we are slowly zeroing in on it.
EDIT: Lee, I failed to mention I do have Insteon modules reacting to noise and sometimes it’s so bad recovery won’t work.
Edited by BeachBum - April 24 2009 at 20:18
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Handman
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 20:22 | IP Logged
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Hmmm. I have a feeling that is is just a normal status scan that takes six minutes to get through the 30 devices. I looked at other addresses and they also appear in groups of 20 at 6 minute intervals. Probably nothing there in the log file I posted.
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grif091
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 21:55 | IP Logged
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Pete, SD Peek 0x2B is the command used to access the device memory to retrieve any configuration data or link database information the HA product (PowerHome in this case) wants to access. Has been that way for as long as I have been using Insteon. I2 introduced an ED message that will process more than a single byte at a time but PowerHome is not using any of that and the ICON switches in the field don't support ED. The Raw Log looks like a standard Status Scan operation when the “Level/Ramp/X10 Scan” option is checked.
New devices like Smarthome's PIR Motion Sensor did not implement Peek/Poke which is why PH cannot read or write link records until PH implements the I2 commands to do the equivalent.
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grif091
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 22:20 | IP Logged
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Handman, I have not found a memory map for the ICON dimmer. Some product manufactures like SimpleHomeNet actually publish the memory map for the useful information in their devices. Smartlabs considers this information proprietary and does not release it to the general public. Over the years some proprietary information has made it into the public domain, like the list of commands I mentioned but I could not find anything online for the ICON memory. You can purchase a Developer subscription that provides access to some of the proprietary information but one has to sign an NDA.
I’m not proposing this, only offering it as a suggestion. You could create a Timed Event that runs every 30 minutes or every hour which executes the ph_getinsteonlevelrt("id of light") only that Pete mentioned. It would put an entry in the Event Log every 30 minutes or every hour showing whether the pantry light was On or Off. Once an entry is found that shows the light On then a review of the Event Log entries between where it is now On to where it was last Off might show what is causing the light to turn On. Of course if it is noise nothing would show in the Event Log. Could over time show that a particular event, even though not directly related to the pantry light itself runs between the time the light is Off and then On. Just depends on how much time you want to invest in this. The Raw Log may still provide useful information, just not the activity from the Status Scan.
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Handman
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 22:33 | IP Logged
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Lee,
Thanks for the update. In have turned off the status scan to minimize the log/network communications/clutter. I will make a timed event like you and Pete suggested and see what I can learn. Given the complexity if the Insteon addresses, I would be surprised that noise is turning it on. I have a feeling there is a simple answer and I'll hit on it soon. I also reset the switch to ensure there was no X10 address associated with it.
Again, thanks for all your thoughtful suggestions.
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grif091
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| Posted: April 24 2009 at 23:05 | IP Logged
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Sounds like a good plan. In addition to the general complexity of an Insteon message, the hardware appends a Cyclic Redundancy Character (CRC) on the end of every message that is sent. As the hardware in the responder device receives the message it constructs a CRC character of its own and compares that generated CRC character against the received message CRC. The probably that noise could construct a good Insteon message in general, but then to also have the noise form a CRC character that matches the Insteon message is very low. Can’t say that a very noisy line cannot do it, just that it would seem unlikely. A device with an X10 address is a completely different matter. The X10 message is short and has no CRC character. Post back when you get new information.
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Handman
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| Posted: April 25 2009 at 00:56 | IP Logged
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OK, I am getting a formula error/syntax error for the light logging formula. What's wrong here? (yes, the switch id name is B13.
Here's how it is written in the timed event:
IF (ph_getinsteonlevelrt ("B13")>0, ph_insteon (“B13”,19,0), 1)
Syntax Error in Formula: IF (ph_getinsteonlevelrt (~"B13~")>0, ph_insteon (“B13”,19,0), 1)
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Handman
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| Posted: April 25 2009 at 01:00 | IP Logged
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Never mind, I think it was a pasted quotation mark that wasn't registering.
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grif091
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| Posted: April 25 2009 at 01:20 | IP Logged
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Quotes are a common problem when taken directly from a forum post. Certain word processors and spell checkers use separate left and right double quotes rather than the vertical double quotes needed by PH.
The double quotes in the ph_getinsteonlevelrt look okay, the double quotes in the ph_insteon look wrong.
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Handman
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| Posted: April 25 2009 at 11:29 | IP Logged
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Well, apparently the rogue pantry light didn't come on until some time between 5:25 am and 6:25 am this morning. The logs, unfortunately, do not show any powerline communications that would have turned it on, only that at 6:25 it was on, and the timed event rules turned it off. Guess I'll monitor it again tonight. The raw log is a lot easier to review without the status scan running. Right now the troubleshooter is set up as a timed event with a raw formula. The drop down menu for "frequency" is set to "hourly" because that is the most frequent. Is there a way to configure it to run every 15 or 30 minutes?
Something turned on the light, but it's not in the raw log or the event log. Noise? Maybe. The thing I find peculiar is that it only happens at night (usually late) when every light is off and the powerline noise should be at it's lowest. The one thing that may be the culprit is a CFC that illuminates by motion. I had a few X10 RR501s and I use one of these in the living room. The light is on from sunset to 11:30 pm and then is activated for ten minutes if there is motion. It seems like a long shot, but the CFC is the only thing I can think of to generate late night powerline noise (maybe the fridge or the dishwasher too). I'll replace the CFC with an incandescent and see what happens.
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grif091
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| Posted: April 25 2009 at 11:53 | IP Logged
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The CFC is a candidate. I don't think it creates a Insteon command so much as the noise makes the power supply in the pantry switch do strange things possibility turning on the switch.
Look at the ph_createtimedevent1 function. It specifies minutes in the freq parameter. Code the function in a macro and then run the macro to establish the timed event.
Edited by grif091 - April 25 2009 at 11:55
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Lee G
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Topic: Event log filtering
