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moduspwnens
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| Posted: September 09 2009 at 22:45 | IP Logged
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Hey there. I just recently have been reading up on the whole "home automation" concept and I am truly interested in how interesting this could be. However, I've found a few hurdles which have me a tad bit turned off about the idea, so I thought I'd post up here to see if someone more experienced might be able to give a little guidance.
A brief check over eBay, Amazon, and a few other sites show modules that tend to be bulky and ugly. If I were to undertake such a project, I would want to make it look professional and primarily undetectable except in function. Are there modules that I could use to accomplish the same net effect, except while retaining things like my house's outlet socket colors and switch styles?
Some of the more interesting things I have in mind involve the computer determining whether or not a room has a person in it. The only things I've really seen in my research are motion and video sensors. However, it seems like these would naturally not be reliable in all normal circumstances. From my (admittedly uninformed) perspective, the only two things that come to mind would be something like a thermal sensor (sensing a person's body heat in the room) or a small dongle that a person could carry which could then be detected by sensors elsewhere. Is there a good, fairly fool-proof way for the system to determine whether or not a person is in a given room?
...and I suppose those are the main issues that came to mind. I appreciate any insight offered.
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bhlonewolf
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| Posted: September 10 2009 at 11:59 | IP Logged
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You have a lot of choices. Most popular home automation technologies -- X10, Insteon, zwave, etc. -- have units that can match your current switch design.
In some cases, you may need some "wall warts" for some devices, but generally it's pretty easy to hide one or two here or there.
As for the room detection -- I won't pull punches here but I'd skip the concept at least for now. For office environments and in some rooms (say, bathrooms, hallways, kitchens) it may be doable, but a living room or other areas, I just don't think it's feasible. I'd ease into HA and slowly expand out.
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moduspwnens
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| Posted: September 10 2009 at 12:10 | IP Logged
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Fair enough. It looks like everything I've read does seem to indicate that there is no affordable, practical solution for determining when a person is or is not in a given room. Either way, it will likely be a fun project if I end up having the money to do it right.
I suppose I'd start out with the basics: turning outlets on and off and perhaps dimming lights. I'd then move on to, perhaps, controlling IR devices like my TV and stereo. After that, maybe I'd look into motion detectors for outdoor lighting. It looks like all of these things are fairly easy to implement.
I think that stops short of being notably practical, though, which I believe is the missing link between this technology (which seems borderline affordable now, but should be quite affordable in a few years) and the mainstream. If I do continue to develop my interest in the area, I'd look into, perhaps, creating some form of easily interface-able thermal camera (which would open all kinds of doors), as well as smaller units that could (perhaps) be used to operate door locks and similar small devices.
Anyway, thanks for your input. I'll continue thinking about this and will appreciate any additional feedback, if anyone would like to offer it.
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BeachBum
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| Posted: September 10 2009 at 14:45 | IP Logged
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Your imagination has no limits when it comes to home automation. I think the real issue is do you want an expensive “turn key” installation or a more affordable “do it yourself” project. The latter is more fun but has its drawbacks such as the learning curve of the software and the frustration of trying to achieve what you designed. If you look at projects with a logical approach then I would pick the DIY theme. The only thing electrical that I manually control are my computers otherwise the whole house is automated with Powerhome, Insteon, and X10. I also detect when someone is in certain areas of the house but that is just for curiosity rather than functionality. Motion detectors work fine indoors but are less reliable outdoors because of thermal variations. Some folks here detect when a person has entered the bathroom and turn on the fan for a period of time and check to see if they are still there before switching the fan off. The question has been asked before if there was a way to detect as to whom. Without individual recognition devices such as card readers or eyeball scanning, there is probably no economical way to achieve personal recognition. Just my 2 cents worth.
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moduspwnens
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| Posted: September 10 2009 at 15:19 | IP Logged
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Personal recognition is less of my concern. I'm more thinking toward
lights and appliances turning on for people and turning off when
nobody is there. Is there a good algorithm / setup for that or is that
something I'd have to develop myself?
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BeachBum
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| Posted: September 10 2009 at 18:11 | IP Logged
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You basically code it yourself using simple If And Or type of logic. You essentially trigger from the event occurring whether it is a particular time of day or if someone was detected in the area then execute a macro you programmed to turn the lights on and later turn them back off at some particular time or delay. The simplest things are turning the lights on/off while the more complex things are announcing who is calling on the phone.
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TonyNo
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| Posted: September 10 2009 at 18:53 | IP Logged
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I have not repackaged it yet, but have been using two motion sensors to count people going in and out of rooms.
One is aimed across the doorway and the other is aimed more inside the room. When the outside triggers first, then the second one fires, I increment a counter. Vice versa for the other way (decrement the counter). When the count goes to zero, the light turns off.
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bhlonewolf
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| Posted: September 11 2009 at 21:08 | IP Logged
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TonyNo wrote:
I have not repackaged it yet, but have been using two motion sensors to count people going in and out of rooms.
One is aimed across the doorway and the other is aimed more inside the room. When the outside triggers first, then the second one fires, I increment a counter. Vice versa for the other way (decrement the counter). When the count goes to zero, the light turns off. |
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So what if 2 people walk in at the same time, and 1 person leaves? :)
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moduspwnens
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| Posted: September 11 2009 at 21:29 | IP Logged
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bhlonewolf wrote:
TonyNo wrote:
I have not repackaged it yet, but have been using two motion sensors to count people going in and out of rooms.
One is aimed across the doorway and the other is aimed more inside the room. When the outside triggers first, then the second one fires, I increment a counter. Vice versa for the other way (decrement the counter). When the count goes to zero, the light turns off. |
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So what if 2 people walk in at the same time, and 1 person leaves? :) |
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This is the kind of problem that discourages me from doing much of anything with something less than 99% reliable.
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TonyNo
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| Posted: September 11 2009 at 22:40 | IP Logged
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Then prepare to stay away from any power-line based technology. 
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hotcoffee76
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| Posted: December 04 2009 at 22:46 | IP Logged
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moduspwnens wrote:
Personal recognition is less of my concern. I'm more thinking toward
lights and appliances turning on for people and turning off when
nobody is there. Is there a good algorithm / setup for that or is that
something I'd have to develop myself? |
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Hi,
I am using this blog post as a starting point for personal recognition.
http://willshouse.com/2009/09/01/review-x10-home-automation- with-arduino/
The concept is sound, and the only major expense here would be time and effort. Of course, there is overhead learning the arduino control board, programming, and diy electronics...
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Topic: Project Goals. Reasonable?
